In the conversation eighteen months in the making, I finally sit down with my pal Jamie Leduc to talk about the Sisler CREATE program, Disney movies, non-silver photography and land art, classroom setup, spaces of learning and spaces of not learning, there’s a brief interruption which proves Jamie’s later point about how visitors drop in, building community, the purpose of school, students’ passion, leaving your mark, the structure of a day of his course, ripping down the barriers, the role of a teacher, and if you should try to recreate Jamie’s model: spoiler - you shouldn't.