Wild Roots Nature School

Today I'm talking with Miss Jenny at Wild Roots Nature School.

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You're listening to A Tiny Homestead, the podcast comprised entirely of conversations with homesteaders, cottage food producers, and crafters.  I'm your host, Mary Lewis.  Today I'm talking with Miss Jenny at Wild Roots Nature School in Indiana. Good afternoon, Miss Jenny. How are you? I'm wonderful. Hi, Mary. It's such a pleasure to be here. It's a pleasure to have you.  The reason I'm calling Miss Jenny Miss Jenny is because I'm sure that's what her little

00:28

humans call her at school.  Or Miss Jimmy.  Those that can't quite pronounce Miss Jenny, they'll say Miss Jimmy.  I love it.  love what you're doing because I love  little kids. Teenagers are a whole different ball game, but little kids are adorable. Yes, they are. My little sprouts make every day so much brighter.  But I have a teenager too, so  I'm balancing  both of them.

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in life right now. So yeah, and they both have their stellar moments, but  teenagers are hard.  It's really hard to know  what kind of mood they're going to be in,  what kind of reception you're going to get to something you say. It's just a whole different thing. It sure is.  So anyway, what's the weather like in Indiana today? It's absolutely gorgeous. So it's a little bit of a breeze, the sun shining.

01:26

The birds are chirping.  It's great. It's not so humid and hot as it has been over the last couple weeks. So I think things are cooling down a bit.  Yeah, the Midwest has gotten its butt kicked in the last couple of weeks with temperatures and humidity.  I'm in Minnesota and  it's still muggy here, but it's not hot today. So that's helping. Yes, it's quite a relief. Yeah.

01:53

have said before and I will say it until the day I die. hate high summer. And for me, high summer is mid-July till the end of August because Minnesota is so crazy from in that timeframe. We never know what the weather is going to be. We could have the most beautiful 65 degree day with a breeze or we could have 105 with tropical dew point or we could have a tornado. You never know.

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So summer is not my favorite season. Spring and fall are my favorites and I wish that we could just do six months of spring and six months of fall. That would be perfect for me.  And the mosquitoes add a whole new challenge to  being outside all day. Yeah. And the black flies. We don't  have too much trouble with that, but the mosquitoes  run us out of here sometimes.  We have black flies every spring and

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my husband will come in and he'll have blood dripping down the side of his neck because they bite him behind his ears. Oh no. Yeah. And they don't, they have, they must have some kind of anesthetic thing in their saliva because he never realizes he's been bitten until I'm like, um, you might want to go get a wet cloth and wipe your neck. And he's like black fly. Oh my goodness.  So yeah, it's, uh,  nature is wonderful. It really is. But there are things that you have to deal with to

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get that wonder. So, absolutely. right. So tell me a little bit about yourself and what you do. So I am the founder of Wild Roots Nature School, which is a nature-based home school nestled right in my own backyard, right here in Indianapolis. It's a play-based

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program where kids are welcome to be wild and free and barefoot and kind of have the freedom to choose how they want to play most days. So it's a emergent type curriculum where I follow the lead of the child in the interest of the children. so if we find

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a caterpillar that will lead to discussions on the life cycle of a butterfly or  right now you can probably hear them.  They're very curious about the cicadas  and  lots of lots of cicada shells  in every pocket  that I find.  So  yeah, it's a mixed age group of  kids ages three to six.

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And it's just, you know,  I grew up like the barefoot running around with my friends and my sister in the fields making  friendship soup out of weeds and pine cones. And  I think that  not many kids have that opportunity to learn and play outside every day anymore.

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Um, there's such a big focus on kindergarten readiness and, um, academics that they just can't play anymore. There's such a, so much pressure to be prepared  for school.  So  we slow it down a bit and focus more on just playing and learning through play and, and  they're learning  all the time.  And it's, it's just beautiful. Lots of giggles and, um,

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Yeah, they just have a blast. Lots of light bulb moments too. Oh yeah.  Yep. So we have chickens and kittens and  currently we found three  black swallowtail caterpillars when we were harvesting our carrots in the garden one morning.  So we've put them in an enclosure and we've been able to  observe the life cycle and

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Unfortunately, we were on vacation last week, but we came home to three chrysalises.  So we should have some butterflies emerging soon. So that's exciting.  We talk about the life cycle of  lots of animals and plants  quite often. So that's really cool.  I love that. Yeah.  I was outside all the time when I was a kid. My mom in the summer,

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Basically, she would be like, go out and play, come back at dinner. Exactly. You'd hear the whistle and you'd have to run home. Yeah. And you could do that back then. And I grew up in a little tiny town in Maine. So  we weren't too worried about us kids getting into trouble when we little. And it's funny because we had a  big old swamp behind our house. It was like,  I don't know, maybe a quarter acre of forest. And then there was a swamp.

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And  behind that swamp was more acres of woods and then there was a lake. And as a mom of four grown children,  I don't know that I would have been comfortable sending my five-year-old out the door where there was so much water, but we all survived it and I loved  it.  knew the difference between a red pine cone, I'm sorry, red  oak acorn and a white oak acorn because my grandpa taught me that white oak

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Acorns are edible and they actually taste good.  Don't eat a red oak acorn because you will pucker up for a week because of the tannins. Good to know.  Yeah, and you can make flour out of either acorn.  I don't know enough about the red one to tell you, but the white oak acorn makes excellent flour.  And I got to see deer just walking through the woods. I got to see bunnies.

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I got to see porcupines, because there's porcupines in the woods in Maine,  and you really don't want to get up close and personal with them, but they're really fun to watch. And it was just a wonderful way to grow up and to learn. And even as a teenager and a young adult, I spent a lot of time outside. So there's something really special about nature.  because you're doing this, do you know any of the scientific backed stuff about

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what nature does to kids? definitely  research is showing that being outside and grounding yourself as a child  is  definitely decreasing  obesity  and  depression.  I know when I get out in nature, I'm  always much happier  and

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very active. so those are two huge benefits to being outside in nature most days.  And again, the more and more research is coming out regarding all the academic pressure that children have to be prepared for kindergarten. And it's just, it's showing that it's not necessary and their, and their brains really aren't ready to hold a pencil  or to start reading.

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or  you have to build those fine motor skills.

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in your hands before you can pick up a pencil and write. So  we still, we still  learn the ABCs and one, two, threes.  It's just not heavily focused on in my program. They have so many, many, many years  to be in school and learn. And they learn a lot of that when they go into kindergarten.  um, yeah,  I think there's tons of benefits to a nature-based program.

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For sure. So how many hours is, are the kids at school a day with you? You know, when I might, I have a teenage son who's flying the coop here in a couple of weeks, he's, he's going to college, but when he went to preschool, it was so difficult to find a preschool that worked within

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the eight to five hours.  I know most of the preschool programs here in Indianapolis, they start at nine and you have to pick up at 3.30. And I'm just like, how in the world do  parents  juggle it all?  And so  I really  designed my program to  cater to the working families, the eight to fives.  So a lot of my students are here all day.

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arriving sometimes at 730 and stay until 5, 530. So the days are long  for me, probably not for them,  but  most of them don't want to leave when it's time. yeah,  and I think the parents are  very grateful for  the flexibility and the hours that I provide for them.  So is it just you? It's just me,  yes.

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It's me and  it's a micro school. So I typically only have around six children  at a time. And my husband is so supportive. He works outside of the home, but  the work is never done. And so he's always ready and  willing to help wherever he can and  puts up with all my crazy ideas. And  I tend to...

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tend to go all out when it comes to birthdays and holidays. it's late nights hanging up  decorations and  all the things. So he's wonderful. I could not do it without him.  OK, number one, that is fabulous. Keep him, husband.  I'm sorry, let's change that. Spouses that support each other are a  miracle.  There are so many people who don't have that blessing.

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And number two,  your students must feel so special and so loved if you put that much energy into this. I hope so. And I  think they do.  I have had one student with me for almost four years. So it's kind of bittersweet. Today is her last day.  She's going to public school, kindergarten tomorrow.

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And  so she  will be leaving. So it's going to be kind of a sad afternoon to say goodbye. But it's never goodbye forever because they always come back and visit and  on their holiday breaks and such. But yeah, there's so much love and  you can just feel it when you come here. It's just a magical. It's just magical. It's like I said, most kids don't have the opportunity to learn.

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and grow up like this. And  the small class size helps  with that close knit community feel and we're like a big family.

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That's so awesome. I love it. I love what you're doing. little girl is going to go through so much culture shock in the next week or so. Oh, I know. She's going be like, aren't we going outside? No, not yet. I know. I know. And it really is quite sad that they only get, I don't know how much actual time kindergartners are spending outside, but it's probably not much. Maybe 30 minutes a day.

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And even some preschools centers here in town are only allowed an hour, which is just.

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Yep,  I have to be really careful about what I say next because I didn't really appreciate the public school system for my kids.  And I have to be careful about what I say because I respect teachers  so much. It is such a hard job  and I think it can be really thankless some days and that's terrible.  But  I also think that

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The system put in place to educate our kids from first grade through senior year  is  not correct.  I feel like if a kid is good at something, they should be allowed to pursue that thing, whether it's singing or math or writing  or lawyering or doctoring or whatever.  And our public school system  is

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basically trying to churn out people that are sort of, kind of half-assed prepared for life. I don't feel like that really serves anyone. When I was in school, I had the same teacher for freshman and sophomore year for my English class. And she was fabulous. And she knew that I had a talent for writing.

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I did not choose to go to college because I was so burnt out on trying to get straight A's  in advanced placement classes. I could not stomach the idea  of rolling right from high school into college. And she caught me in the hallway one day at the end of senior year and she said,  I would be happy to make you or write you a recommendation for Thomas College,  which was a famous college in Maine, still is probably, for people who wanted to pursue writing. And I politely declined.

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And she said, why? And I said, because I'm not going to college. And she had tears in her eyes when I told her that.  And she said, why? And I said, because I can't do it. I said, I have been pushed and pushed and pushed and I have done my absolute best to get the best grades I possibly can.  And I am just burnt out. I can't do this another year in a row. And  she said,  I understand.  Still had tears in her eyes.

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And I didn't go to college and I don't regret it at all. I'm good.  I learn  so much from books and from people and from the world that I feel like I've gotten three degrees in something, but I just don't have a piece of paper to prove it. So it's, it's hard with my kids.  They were all  very bright people  and I can still remember my youngest. He's a boy.

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We went in for a parent teacher conference and his  teacher, he was in third or fourth grade, was like, he is not at  grade level for reading. And I said, that doesn't surprise me.  And he said, why not? And I said, because it takes a special book.  There's a unique book for every kid that hooks them into reading.  And then all of a sudden, all the synapses go,  hey, this is fun. And they start becoming avid readers.

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I said, I went through it in first grade. My daughter went through it in first grade. My oldest son went through it in  sixth grade. Oh, wow. I said, I think boys come to reading, loving reading a lot later than girls do. And I they all learn on a different level at a different time. It does eventually click. Yeah. And so the teacher was like, well, we should probably get him on an independent  education program thing.

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And I said, absolutely not. And he looked at me like I had lost my marbles.  And I said, I am the mother. This is my child. I said, you need my permission to get that started.  I said, I do not give you my permission. I said, he will probably be reading at grade level by next year. And he said, OK.

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He said, I'm just telling you what I'm seeing. And I said, I'm just telling you what I've experienced in raising four kids.  I I appreciate your opinion.  And if I really thought there was a problem, I would be all for this. said, but I don't think there is, and it's not going to hurt him to not  be on an IEP program. And he said, okay. And I said, okay. So the following year, my youngest picked up the book, Aragon.

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by Christopher Paolini, I think is his last name.  And he sat down and he opened the book and I said, you're ready? And he's like, why? And I said, this is gonna change your life. And he looked at me like I was not.  And he started reading and he devoured that book. And after he would close the book, after he read some, I would say, tell me about the story. And he would tell me the story. I'd already read it. He was comprehending it.  He was getting it. He was loving it.

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and he's been an avid reader ever since.  In the process of him  reading that book, he had chosen that for the thing at school where they get points for something to keep track of their reading level.  Like, book it, I think. Yeah, something like that, yeah. And he ended up getting all of his points for the rest of the year, which was like five months, you know, it was five months left to school.  All of his points for the rest of the year. And at the end of the year, he got a little  certificate.

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that said that he was the highest, I don't know, he was the one who had come the furthest in reading that year. And he came home just waving that thing at me. And I said, did you take this to your teacher from last year and show him? said, I sure did mom. Good for him. I said, good. And I called the next day and the teacher happened to be the one from the previous year. And I said, I absolutely am not calling to say I told you so. I said, because that's rude.

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I said, what was Cameron's face like when you saw that certificate in his hand? He said he was glowing.  said, sometimes mama intuition is true. He said, that's better than I told you so. I said, yes, it is. that's awesome that you advocated for him.  And  I have a similar experience  with my teenager. He went through public school and had an individual education plan. And yeah, I just.

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I'm with you. mean, the teachers are overworked and underpaid and the system  is broken.  And I have a five year old who's in  a student at Wild Roots  and  currently and  going through that with my first born son, I said, not again, you know, we're not doing this again. So he'll be home with me and we'll home school  and  he's excited about it.

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Yeah. And like I said, I wanted to be really careful about how I frame that because I  have the utmost respect for people who teach.  is an amazing skill that I don't really have. I mean,  I try, but I'm not set up  to teach a bunch of people at the same time. just not, it's not in my,  it's not in my blood. It's definitely not for everyone. Yeah. It's a hard job and it's a special skill.  again,

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utmost respect. I have a problem with the actual education  system. Yes, I have referred to it as state mandated daycare for a long time because that's how it feels to me. Yep.  and yeah, it's so regulated and you don't have the freedom to  follow the child's interests  and  build a curriculum based off what they like or have them choose what they want to read and

22:40

Uh, yeah, it's just...

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It's unfortunate and hopefully they make changes in the next  couple years to make the system better. until then,  Hudson will be home with mama.  Good. You do what you need to do for your child because that's most important thing.  Also,  what was I going to say? What's the feedback from the parents in your program?

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Oh, they're all just  so grateful  to have me and the dedicated. They see me, they appreciate me  and  our communication throughout the day and even  through the evening and on the weekends.  It's very, we talk a lot and,  you know, we talk a lot about the day and what they've done. send lots of pictures and they just, they love that. And the reason why I

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started my business 18 years ago is because I didn't want to be away from my child every day. And I just can't imagine how difficult that is to have to trust somebody to raise your child all day.  And so yeah, they're forever grateful for sure.  Do the kids go home and tell mom and dad or mom and mom or dad and dad or just mom or just dad because that's how families are now. Yes. And I'm not being a smart ass. That's how families are now.  Did they go home and tell mom and dad about the

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the butterfly chrysalis or the frog that they caught or do you know? You know,  this age is kind of,  you'll ask them what they did today and they'll be like nothing.  But I do think that because I do share so many pictures  with the parents that they can  prompt the conversation with, oh, it looks like you did this. And then that will prompt a conversation about what they did today or  what they learned.  But yeah, they.

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I hope they talk about how much fun and how much they learn on a daily, but I haven't really gotten a whole lot of feedback about whether or not they do share with mom and dad or mom and mom. Yeah. Okay. I was just curious because I was one of those kids that I would come home from school or from an outing or whatever. And I would be like, did you guys know? And then tell them the thing I learned. Yeah. And no joke, like five out of 10 times.

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my dad, who I consider to be the smartest man I know, would look at me and say,  no, I actually had never heard that before. Tell me more.  And whether he had or hadn't heard it, I don't know, but he  would either feign interest or he would actually be interested and want to know more. And that was really great.  know, I'm  aside with, you know, I'm learning aside with them.  We learned this

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stuff, the life cycles and being able to identify trees and we learned that maybe in third, fourth grade, but you forget it, you know, so it's so much fun to relearn all of, I mean, there's so much to learn. There's so much knowledge identifying mushrooms and  trees and  it's just, it's really fun  to learn again. Yeah. And it's funny to hear you say learn again, because I am

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Like I always say I have got to know ITIS. Like I have perpetual curiosity. Yeah. And so for me, I'm always, always, always learning. Like there is no, again, it's just a continuous cycle of information in, oh, that's cool. What else is there to know? It's for you. And it's part of the reason I started the podcast because I was like, Hey, if I talk to people who are doing stuff in nature, I'm going to learn all kinds of things I don't know yet. And I'm 55. I want to learn until I die. And an empty nester, right?

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Almost. Okay.  Yeah, the youngest,  he doesn't like me to talk about this, but he has a mild form of epilepsy. And so  he cannot be by himself. Yeah.  And so he's still here and I'm okay with that. He's great.  He loves to cook. He earns his keep by helping out on the farm. He's great.  So it's one of those things.  Yeah.

27:09

It's so helpful because I'm 55, his dad's 56. And we had a whole bunch of logs brought in to be cut and split for our wood burning boiler for heat in the wintertime. And he's been out there just busting his hump helping dad with the wood. And he gets the eggs from the chickens and he puts them in the farm stand for sale. And he does a whole bunch of chores for us, which is so helpful. Oh, I bet. Yeah, it's exhausting work, especially at 55.

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Yeah, and I know it's nice to have that help Yeah, and I mean if I had taken better care of myself in my younger years instead of being down on the floor with four kids playing Are you there? Oh, I'm here Okay,  if I hadn't spent like years raising kids and being down on the floor with them  on my knees playing blocks and Legos and stuff  I probably would be in better shape, but I don't regret doing all that at all. Yeah  So it's just it's great to have an able-bodied kid

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who's here all the time and he's a terrific cook. He makes,  makes, what is it? He debones chicken thighs and then he fries them like fried chicken and  I won't do it. I hate working with hot fat. It scares me and I watch and I make sure that I'm there, but he does such a great job and I don't even like chicken thighs, but  he makes them so good that I will eat them.

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That is too funny because my oldest who's 18, that's his specialty too. And he just cooked the same thing a couple nights ago for us. And I'm with you. I don't really like handling raw chicken and I'm not, I don't really like to fry things, but when he takes, takes the lead and cooks for us, it's so good. Yeah. And it's so, I don't know. I have such pride that I did it right. Yeah.

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Yeah, it's nice to be served every once in a while. Yeah. And the thing is, I invited all of my kids into the kitchen when I used to cook. I'm a little teary.  I  just wanted them...  The rule in my house was that they needed to know how to do their own laundry.  They had to be able to do dishes by hand and get them actually clean.  And they needed to be able to cook at least one meal and one dessert that they would be proud to serve to their friends  before they moved out. I love that.

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And all of them can do it. Even my daughter who decided to go vegan for a while,  she can cook a good dinner and a dessert for her friends. That's awesome. We cook, we're in the kitchen quite often and  we  try to use our produce from the gardens. We have an overabundance of  cucumbers and  tomatoes right now. So think everybody's a little tired of the cucumber.

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cream cheese sandwiches.  I'm  jealous because all of our cucumber plants died. Oh no, you didn't get any?  Nope, they got the blight because it's been such a weird summer here again in Minnesota. been so bizarre. Yeah, it's been rain for three days and then hot sun and then three days of rain and then hot sun and cucumbers do not do well with that. They get wet and moldy and they blight and they die.

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Mine are on their way out, but at least we  a pretty good harvest beforehand. Yep. So I've given my husband notice that if anyone at the farmer's market this weekend when he's there selling our tomatoes  has cucumbers,  to please trade  our tomatoes for cucumbers. Because I have not had a garden fresh cucumber yet this summer. Oh my goodness. We need to change that.  Yeah.  I love cucumbers. I was so looking forward to the first cucumber.

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And he came in the other day and he said, we're not getting cucumbers.  I said,  I said a bad word. And then I said, excuse me. And he said, they're dead, honey. He said, they're, they're not going to produce this year. He said, I know you're going to cry.  And I'm proud of myself. I didn't cry.  I didn't slam cabinet doors. I didn't stomp around. didn't act like a toddler.  I just said that that's okay because somebody will have them at the farmer's market. And I love a good trade.

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Yeah, he grandies that I'm so proud of you. He said, I knew you were going to be able to handle it. I'm like, yep, that's fine. But it's the second summer in a row with no cucumbers because last year was bad too. I'm like, last year it was bad for us too. So it's a thing and everybody tells me and I tell everybody gardening is a crap shoot. You just don't know what's going to happen. It really is. We started seeds in a greenhouse for the first time this year.

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And that was so much fun because you got to kind of get started a little bit earlier and  harvest happened a little bit sooner than if we would have waited. So it  was really fun to be able to watch the kids plant the seeds and then be able to watch it grow and grow.  Yeah, kind of like they are. They're just growing too fast.  Yeah.

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I know and it's it's a blink in the eye miss Jenny. It really is. know. I know. I But I have to let them fly. Yeah, it's so hard. I don't want to cry on my podcast today. I'm trying really hard not to. But it's so hard. And when they get married, it's like what? Oh old enough to be married? That's crazy. So and I don't.

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This is sound really dumb. have a grandchild, but she is a step-grandchild. Love her like she's just my own biological grandchild, but she's not related to me biologically. And she's 12. I never saw her as a baby because my stepson hadn't met her her mom yet. Yeah. So I haven't gone through any of my  biological children having  babies.  And I don't think I'm going to because the other kids don't want babies.

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I'm actually good with this because it hurt enough to let  my  own babies go. I can't imagine what it would be like to have to be like, oh my God, my grandchild is having babies. What?  You know? I don't even want to think about it. It's just not. Time is so weird.  coming back to  little Leonora, who's leaving today after  caring for her for four years,  when any of my preschool kids

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leave and we have to say goodbye. There's one of my favorite books. I usually gift them and it's called Miss Maple Seeds. And there's a line in the book that  our conversation reminded me of. And it says, take care, my little ones for the world is big and you are small, but never forget even the grandest of trees  once had to grow up from the smallest of seeds. I love that.

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Yeah, I just, really speaks to my heart about just really how much care you have to take with these tiny little seeds, these little kids that you're molding into little humans. And I'm just so proud of each and every one of them when they, when they walk away, it's like, I did that. I helped do that. You know, it's so, it's such a rewarding job.

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I love that for you and that is not the snotty, I love that for you. I absolutely love that for you. And I'm so proud of you for what you've chosen to do. It's a beautiful location. Thank you. It's definitely tiring, but very rewarding. And I couldn't imagine doing anything else with my life. And not everybody can say that. So I'm just very grateful.

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Yeah, you've found your calling and you are living it and you are helping other people to become  functioning adult good people. Yeah.  So keep doing that because we need more of those.  Yeah, we do. Yeah, we do.  All right. Where can people find you, Miss Jenny?  I am on Facebook. You can look up Wild Roots Nature School and you can check out the magic there.

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I'm kind of behind on the times when it comes to social media and such. But I'll get there one day. You're too busy raising little human beings. And every time I touch a computer, it just doesn't cooperate. I've learned what I'm good at and what I'm not good at and stay away from the computer as much as possible. I understand. I am learning. I am learning. Yeah, it took me a long time to figure out things on the computer. And then it made sense and it was OK.

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Computers are finicky beasts when they work great. They work great when they don't they really don't and thankfully my very supportive husband who I've already bragged about today is in  IT so  He can help me with all things computers, but For now, I'm gonna stay as far away as possible That is very convenient and very helpful. Yes. All right, as always people can find me at a tiny homestead podcast calm

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Ms. Jenny, I appreciate your time today. Thank you. Thank you. It was such an honor to be here. Have a great day. Thanks. You too.